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Post by thegreenmeanie on Mar 9, 2009 23:17:04 GMT -5
news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090309/ap_on_re/rel_religious_americaA wide-ranging study on American religious life found that the Roman Catholic population has been shifting out o of the Northeast to the Southwest, the percentage of Christians in the nation has declined and more people say they have no religion at all.
Fifteen percent of respondents said they had no religion, an increase from 14.2 percent in 2001 and 8.2 percent in 1990, according to the American Religious Identification Survey.
Northern New England surpassed the Pacific Northwest as the least religious region, with Vermont reporting the highest share of those claiming no religion, at 34 percent. Still, the study found that the numbers of Americans with no religion rose in every state.
"No other religious bloc has kept such a pace in every state," the study's authors said.Very interesting, especially when you look at the changes geographically. It seems like religion one day will be in regions much like you see with red and blue states in politics. That is my opinion, but I hope I keep seeing studies like this. If I did a study like this I would want to test how many of the people polled who are saying they are religious are from the baby boomer era (especially the Catholics). I wonder if the decrease has to do with more of them passing? A lot of interesting questions from the study.
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Post by TMWight on Mar 10, 2009 8:30:21 GMT -5
It's all about how you were raised I think. Growing up we didn't go to church all that much and God wasn't talked about all too much. When I was in 5th grade though it was pushed on me pretty hard, my sister and I even went to a Catholic school. I hated it growing up but I miss it now. I think your profession helps you find God as well.
I'm proud of being Catholic, although the Pope would not be too happy with my liberal views.
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Post by badgernation on Mar 10, 2009 11:20:07 GMT -5
I have never been a regular church going type of person.... It was the way we were raised. My Dad was Catholic and my Mom was a Presbyterian and when I was young we went to a Lutheran Church because it was the closest to where I lived.... As I got older I was.... (God forgive me) whatever my girlfriend at the time was.... I believe I've been to just about about every Church at one time or another....
Why is church attendance going down? No more miracles from the heavens? Decay of moral standards? No fear of life after death? If there is no Heaven or Hell.... Why be good? Has science replaced God as our all powerful force?
That said I have always believed that God and Myself have our own thing going on....
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Post by thegreenmeanie on Mar 10, 2009 11:59:53 GMT -5
I am not religious at all. I do believe there is something greater than us but that doesn't mean it is a God in the sense that you read about in organized religion. The Jesus story is in many cultures and many dead religions over time. Therefore I believe it is just a story and that people have sculpted different religions from it. I don't hate religion. I think it has a purpose. I do believe that purpose is often skewed by powerful people who take advantage of it. Religion in its main sense is to make you follow (the Shepard and the sheep) to become a better and more enriched person. When people tie these things with politics and agendas it becomes very dangerous. I know not everyone uses religion for that and I am witness to the good things it does every day. I pick up people who know they are going to die all the time, and in the small talk we have a lot of them say something a long the lines of "I have made my peace with God and am ready to enjoy the time I have." That to me is very good. Let them focus on what is left and not be afraid. Which brings me to another point. I believe many people are religious because they are afraid to die. Please don't take offense to this, I am not judging individual people, just stating I think that is a personal factor in many people's decisions. It's human nature to fear the unknown, and religion gives them a version of an answer, and a happy one at that. In the end everyone needs something to get them through life. Whether its a religion, their family, hell the Packers . I just wish we could get religion out of politics and decisions made for a majority of people. That is not what it is about.
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WhatUSaid
Practice Squad
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Posts: 931
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Post by WhatUSaid on Mar 10, 2009 13:55:34 GMT -5
Let me say Church girls are awesome.
I wouldn't classify my self as belonging to a specific religion. I was raised(baptized) going to a Lutheran church. I went to a presbyterian church that had a youth group, it was cool but... meh I don't know. I've been to synagogues and even catholic churches.
I was asked by a pastor why I thought I should go to heaven. I gave him an answer, he basically said that wasn't enough. OK. I know I'm a good person(yeah I'm good) if someone says I'm not good enough what can I do. Why should I have to prove it to anyone. Doesn't GOD know I'm good.
I guess I don't like the idea that going to church makes you a good person. I have met many that make me believe the contrary.
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Post by TW on Mar 10, 2009 14:24:14 GMT -5
Most people, when they're young, and going to live forever, don't think too much about faith.
When they get older, that can change. They think about whether or not there is a hereafter, and whether or not they believe in it enough to do something about it.
This isn't something new. It's been like this for a long, long time.
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oml
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Post by oml on Mar 10, 2009 15:42:33 GMT -5
The natives of the Northwest got it right... feel free to send me cash and I will bless you
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Post by thegreenmeanie on Mar 10, 2009 15:58:18 GMT -5
Most people, when they're young, and going to live forever, don't think too much about faith. When they get older, that can change. They think about whether or not there is a hereafter, and whether or not they believe in it enough to do something about it. This isn't something new. It's been like this for a long, long time. I agree and that is why I think a lot of it has to do with a fear of death, even if you are not able to admit it I believe it is an underlined fear in human progression and religion gives you a happy ending way to deal with it. Now I am sure that once you get into something of course you will find better reasons as to why you are there than "I am afraid of death", I just believe that is a main factor in getting people to look towards the idea of religion. From my own stand point it would be impossible for me to predict where I will be in 40 years if I am even around and what my thinking will be centered around. However I don't see myself being able to dismiss some of the things I have learned. Therefore I feel I will never be a religious person, but anything is possible I guess.
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Post by firemancheesehead on Mar 12, 2009 16:01:31 GMT -5
I am an atheist, and ya know what? Despite the rhetoric from the fundagelicals, I live a very happy and fulfilling life.
I have no need for any god/gods.
I am happy with the awe and wonderment of the universe.
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mag7ue
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Post by mag7ue on Mar 15, 2009 23:34:03 GMT -5
Interesting responses on this - quite possibly the most civilized religion discussion I've ever seen on the internet.
I'll try not to stir things up too much, but two questions came to mind as I read this thread:
1. Assume for a minute that there IS a Heaven and Hell. What do you think you have to do to go to Heaven? Can you be sure, or is the best we can get is to "hope" and see when we die?
2. I think everyone here would agree that Jesus was a real man that actually lived on earth. With that assumption, what do you believe he was? A liar, lunatic, or Lord of all creation? Because if he actually lived, he's one of the three.
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Post by firemancheesehead on Mar 16, 2009 12:53:49 GMT -5
Interesting responses on this - quite possibly the most civilized religion discussion I've ever seen on the internet. I'll try not to stir things up too much, but two questions came to mind as I read this thread: 1. Assume for a minute that there IS a Heaven and Hell. What do you think you have to do to go to Heaven? Can you be sure, or is the best we can get is to "hope" and see when we die? That's a great question. What does it take? 2. I think everyone here would agree that Jesus was a real man that actually lived on earth. With that assumption, what do you believe he was? A liar, lunatic, or Lord of all creation? Because if he actually lived, he's one of the three. Obedience to a lord and master or a selfless act of compassion? What is funny to me is that xtianity-in particular-requires strict obedience to gain entry to heaven. An act of selfless compassion isn't a golden ticket. I would be willing to admit that Jesus was based on either a real person or persons. There is no mention of him outside the Bible ( Greek/Roman/Egytpian) and the biblical apologists. There were many saviour cults in the region during the period Jesus was supposed to have lived. Jesus' life parallels Zoroaster and Apolonious of Tyana. Add to that, many of the pagan myths had gods who's life was similar to Jesus ( born of a virgin etc ). My issue with Jesus being a real person is that the Bible has him being born and then*poof* he's a 20 something. That's a bit odd in my book. All of the Gospels were written anywhere from 40-100 years after his 'life'. Sheesh, peopel can't even get their stories straight on Elvis, and he died just over 30 years ago. The gospel of Peter says that King Herrod had Jesus killed. 2 of the gospels say that Jesus was born from a virgin-the others don't. That's a big oversight. The fact of the matter is, that people hate to have their belief system challenged. I know that you are a religious person, Mag, I am curious to haer your take.
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Post by firemancheesehead on Mar 16, 2009 13:01:08 GMT -5
I have always wondered about this Hebrews 8:4 8:4 For if he were on earth, he should not be a priest, seeing that there are priests that offer gifts according to the law
So, he is speaking about Jesus, but a Jesus that was never on earth, but some alternate mythical plane.
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Post by snowpack on Mar 16, 2009 13:55:58 GMT -5
God or no God is a debate that will last until the end of time. It is something that can neither be proven or unproven. If you believe, you have faith that what you believe is correct, because until you pass, there is no way to know for sure.
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Post by packerconvert on Mar 16, 2009 18:39:18 GMT -5
It would be interesting to see how the numbers changed if they were asked about having spirituality versus having religion.
I would classify myself as spiritual versus religious. I perceive God in the Christian context for that is how I was raised, but I am not constrained in the sense that I believe there is an actual hell or that the stories told in the bible are true.
I think all are right in their belief about the universe. As stated earlier, neither view can be proven as to if there is something greater beyond this life.
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mag7ue
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Post by mag7ue on Mar 17, 2009 0:05:15 GMT -5
I think all are right in their belief about the universe. As stated earlier, neither view can be proven as to if there is something greater beyond this life. That's an interesting take, PC. Everyone is right? I didn't know that was possible, even in a pretend world. FCH, I'm not sure I can give you "my take" in this context. I don't mean that as a cop-out of any sense - it's just that there's no way to explain the ins and outs of the true Christain faith on an internet forum. But here's a few points. Regarding your Hebrews 8:4 verse - it's hardly saying Jesus was never on earth - He simply wasn't at the time that was written. Why is that hard to understand? I personally find it frustrating that people who don't believe demand proof - yet also fully understand that Christianity is based on faith. Skeptics are always going to find things to be skeptical about. If that's what you want to be, go ahead. Christianity teaches that FAITH ALONE in Jesus Christ and His death covering the sins of all men, confessing those sins and asking forgiveness (and believing by FAITH that He grants forgiveness) will allow you to live eternally with Him in Heaven. (1 John 1:9, John 3:16, Romans 3:23-26). Further (and PC this is for you also), without believing that the Bible is a true and literal account of actual historical events, how can you claim any of what's in it as true? Basically, you're making stuff up then - because if you can't believe the stories, you can't believe the part about Jesus dying on the cross. If you can't believe Jesus dying on the cross, then there is no more Christianity. Picking the parts that sound good to you and going with that completely bastardizes the whole thing! And nowhere in the Bible does it say that faith requires "strict obedience" for entry to Heaven. It's not a "you make a mistake, you're out" type of thing. The Bible clearly teaches that once you have accepted the gift of eternal life (salvation), it's yours forever (John 10:29). The whole point is that once you fully understand what Christ did for you, the love He has for you, and the life He wants for you, that you will WANT to obey Him. It's unfortunate in my mind that so many Christians don't live the kind of life a follower of Jesus Christ should. In my opinion, the lack of Christians living what they believe causes many others to disbelieve. An agnostic, atheist, Buddhist, Muslim, whoever should be able to tell a Christian by simply watching him/her - no words, no interaction, nothing. Unfortunately that doesn't happen too often.
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