Chicago first out of Olympic bids!

[TW]

Incredible! This is a statement against US foreign policy over the last decade!

[packerconvert]

No, this is a statement against our arrogant, naive and dangerous President.

Suck it up!

[TW]

Incredible! You remember Bush as a champion, and he was arguably the worst President in history.

You blame Obama, who is trying to reestablish our reputation around the world, as a leader.

I think your motivation is so obvious that it's not worth discussing.

[Deleted]

No PC - Bush is not longer our president...

[packerconvert]

Oct 2, 2009 10:35:17 GMT -5 TW said:

Incredible! You remember Bush as a champion, and he was arguably the worst President in history.

You blame Obama, who is trying to reestablish our reputation around the world, as a leader.

I think your motivation is so obvious that it's not worth discussing.

Your memory is myopic. I have never Championed Bush and have often chided where he was wrong, namely the Patriot Act, but I digress.

You will never admit that this President can and does fail. So I agree, this topic is closed due to your selective memory to justify your scorn of my position.

I do have to disagree that an apology tour is the route to "leadership."

How's that Iran thing working out.

[Deleted]

Oct 2, 2009 10:42:43 GMT -5 packerconvert said:

Oct 2, 2009 10:35:17 GMT -5 TW said:

Incredible! You remember Bush as a champion, and he was arguably the worst President in history.

You blame Obama, who is trying to reestablish our reputation around the world, as a leader.

I think your motivation is so obvious that it's not worth discussing.

Your memory is myopic. I have never Championed Bush and have often chided where he was wrong, namely the Patriot Act, but I digress.

You will never admit that this President can and does fail. So I agree, this topic is closed due to your selective memory to justify your scorn of my position.

I do have to disagree that an apology tour is the route to "leadership."

How's that Iran thing working out.

That is laughable at best! Talk about lack of memory. You could have been on the excuse campaing for Bush when he was in office.

[packerconvert]

True. I had a bigger understanding of the issues that led those to believe I was supporting Bush instead of the Presidency. For instance, "I don't think it's cool to re-write the constitution like many Dems proposed."

The thing with liberals is the only need one excuse to explain their failures away.

"It was Bush's fault."

"I didn't read the intelligence reports about Iraq and voted yes because it was Bush's fault."

"Islamofacist didn't cause 9/11. 9/11 was Bush's fault."

SEE HOW That works. The only thinking involved in blaming Bush is typing out the phrase. "It's Bush's fault."

I will have to give liberals one Kudo. They sure have problem solving abilities with little to no thinking. How efficient!

[brewerbruce]

Oct 2, 2009 10:32:23 GMT -5 packerconvert said:

This is a statement against our arrogant, naive and finally long gone President Bush.

Suck it up!

FIXED!!!!!!

[brewerbruce]

I wonder what the IOC would say if the US decided that they no longer wanted to particpate in the Olympics?

It was a long shot at best for Obama to get Chicago the bid. I had heard awhile back that Chicago had "0" chance of winning and I guess that was true in the end.

[brewerbruce]

Rio de Janeiro to host 2016 Olympics

[thegreenmeanie]

Oct 2, 2009 10:55:35 GMT -5 packerconvert said:

True. I had a bigger understanding of the issues that led those to believe I was supporting Bush instead of the Presidency. For instance, "I don't think it's cool to re-write the constitution like many Dems proposed."

The thing with liberals is the only need one excuse to explain their failures away.

"It was Bush's fault."

"I didn't read the intelligence reports about Iraq and voted yes because it was Bush's fault."

"Islamofacist didn't cause 9/11. 9/11 was Bush's fault."

SEE HOW That works. The only thinking involved in blaming Bush is typing out the phrase. "It's Bush's fault."

I will have to give liberals one Kudo. They sure have problem solving abilities with little to no thinking. How efficient!

Please... Those dems weren't in the meeting at the White House demanding a connection with Sadam. Those Dems were not the ones on TV sitting there telling you day and night how they hate your freedom and if we don;t act NOW we could be attacked again. Those Dems were not the commander and chief and were not the ones who lead a scare campaign backed by 0 intelligence so they could get their foot back into the middle east.

No sir, those Dems were like almost everyone else in the country at that time. Scared to death and expecting their president to tell them what was going to be the right choice, and the safe choice. None of that was delivered and a lot of them were scared into this war just like the American public was. Bush was a disgrace to the office, to the constitution, and to rational thinkers all over the world.

You keep defending him and forget those little things we like to call facts. 0 evidence connecting someone to an attack and then deciding to go to war against them... That is not what a president does, that is what a dictator does.

[TW]

Above all, they were with us, anticipating that the President of the United States wouldn't lie to them. He'd be honest.

Sadly, he was lying the moment his mouth started to move.

[packerconvert]

Please... Those dems weren't in the meeting at the White House demanding a connection with Sadam. Those Dems were not the ones on TV sitting there telling you day and night how they hate your freedom and if we don;t act NOW we could be attacked again. Those Dems were not the commander and chief and were not the ones who lead a scare campaign backed by 0 intelligence so they could get their foot back into the middle east.

Please, must I keep refreshing memories?

Following 9/11, it was clear that terrorist could no longer be tolerated or contained in the Middle East. We were lucky enough to enjoy the several bombings of American installations across the Middle East and the loss of precious lives therein, an invasion of allies by rogue regimes, the support of terrorism abroad, up to and including Saddam paying the families of suicide bombers in the West Bank(that means supporting of terrorism kids.)

Saddam Hussein was just as much a part of the terrorist problem ,pre 9/11,in the Middle East as both he and Osama reached beyond the borders of the countries they resided in to wreak havoc upon US Citizens and US policy. Following loss of life on 9/11 forward, it was clear that people like Osama, Saddam could and would not be tolerated. Why do you think your friend Quadaffi gave up his nukes? This wasn't about Iraq only. It was about allowing looney tune regimes who killed innocents abroad to no longer exist safely. Is it that fricken hard to understand?

No sir, those Dems were like almost everyone else in the country at that time. Scared to death and expecting their president to tell them what was going to be the right choice, and the safe choice. None of that was delivered and a lot of them were scared into this war just like the American public was. Bush was a disgrace to the office, to the constitution, and to rational thinkers all over the world.

Vomit. Bush was the first President that didn't go to breakfast ever day satisfied that only 40 Americans were killed in a terrorist attack somewhere. Following 9/11, it was time to bring out the big guns and treat terrorism as a national defense issue versus a Barney Five, send in the cops issue.

I can't think of anything more disgraceful than to let Americans die and all of America go on it's merry way with out so much as an "Oh my God. Innocent Americans were killed today." The aforementioned was how terrorist actions were treated when bombed overseas. Most Americans don't even know what the U.S.S Cole is or was, but at least by God we didn't go to war over it. How many deadd Americans do we need before war is justified? Obviously enough weren't killed under the Clinton Administration to justify.


You keep defending him and forget those little things we like to call facts. 0 evidence connecting someone to an attack and then deciding to go to war against them... That is not what a president does, that is what a dictator does.


First, we didn't go after Saddam right away. If I recall, the Taliban was chased out of power. Am I right? Huh? Am I?

9/11 occurred on September 11, 2001. Iraq was not invaded until March of 2003. Definitely, enough time for Dems to read intelligence reports and for Saddam to simply, fricken comply. Is a year and a half enough time to co-operate with the UN to avoid military conflict?

As mentioned above, it was clear that rogue nations who provided safe haven for terrorist or sponsored terrorist could not exist in a post 9/11 era.

Ergo, after the 35th time of telling Saddam he must co-operate or face consequences; Saddam finally faced the consequences of not abiding by his 1990's agreements.

Hello!! We had every right to knock Saddam out per the cease fire. What is a cease fire everyone? Can someone from World affairs define what a cease fire is? What it means to have conditions of a cease fire?

Yeah..dictators give up their power as if you even know what it is like to live under a dictator. Don't throw the term around so loosely.

[thegreenmeanie]

That was beautiful. To help me really get the point I pictured the American flag blowing behind you the whole time you wrote that.

You will not admit that Bush wanted in Iraq even before 9/11 fell into his lap? Whether he was funding terrorism is a moot point. He was an a-hole. No one is defending Saddam. We are defending the fact that he took a tragedy like 9/11 and decided to super size it by changing the focus from a "war"on terrorism to his own agenda that got him back into Iraq and the middle east. You are probably one of the people who sat there and said "how many times have we gotten attacked since?" How many times would we of been attacked if the branches of the Gov did their d**n job and communicated with each other? I'll give you a hit, it rhymes with hero.

Whether you think the war was justified or not it was still illegal. Bush never proved Iraq was in violation of UN Resolutions by still being in possession of weapons of mass destruction, and secondly, that Iraq was behind 9-11. He never proved any of that, he just decided they were off of his zero intelligence he was demanding be cooked up for that year you were speaking of and decided to go right in there. Then he had the gull to declare mission accomplished.

This man was a buffoon and disgraced this country, and cost many young Americans and Iraqi people their lives by not doing his homework, by listening to yes men, and by having no idea of what this enemy was he was going to fight head on, and by not letting generals fight the war. Not only that but he lied to the American people, and the worst part of it all was he told those people that were there and actually suffered through 9/11 that he would get Bin Laden. The man that a month later he really wasn't too concerned with. He took a horrible moment in our nations history, in those people lives and turned it into his own agenda. I don't even want to go into the patriot act.

I know my vocabulary. I know he was not a dictator, but the way he handled this was mirroring one. Thank goodness we do live in this country where he couldn't have full control. Although he sure tried with his scare campaign. "Give up freedoms and you'll be safe."Have the gov do their d**n jobs, and we would of been safe!

You want a clear solution to all of this. You don't want our bases being attacked in these parts of the world? Leave them. There is no need for us to be there. The only reason we are in these parts are for oil or to have a presence. Lets just leave there. Why wait for someone to blow up a base and bomb them for a week and a half. Whats the point?

Him funding terror and terrorist blowing up American bases does not justify taking a tragedy like 9/11 and using it to go after someone they failed to get 10 years before. Telling those families one thing and doing another is not okay, and it sure as hell isn't the "American" thing to do. Or so I've been told in school.

[packerconvert]

That was beautiful. To help me really get the point I pictured the American flag blowing behind you the whole time you wrote that.

You will not admit that Bush wanted in Iraq even before 9/11 fell into his lap? Whether he was funding terrorism is a moot point. He was an a-hole. No one is defending Saddam. We are defending the fact that he took a tragedy like 9/11 and decided to super size it by changing the focus from a "war"on terrorism to his own agenda that got him back into Iraq and the middle east. You are probably one of the people who sat there and said "how many times have we gotten attacked since?" How many times would we of been attacked if the branches of the Gov did their d**n job and communicated with each other? I'll give you a hit, it rhymes with hero.

I am sure Bush was not alone as many Americans were scratching their heads in wonderment as to why Saddam Hussein was still in power after his unwillingness to abide by the cease fire that he signed. It was later shown why through the Oil for Food program, but I guess there are those that find it more amenable to have innocent Iraqi's die under sanctions and let the greedy become more wealthy off their suffering.

Your sense of justice is warped.

The fact that Saddam funding is not a moot point. You only say that because it conflicts with your linear though processes. The War on Terrorism was a war against all terrorist from the Phillipines forward.

Saddam did not abide by UN Sanctions and paid the price for not doing so.

Whether you think the war was justified or not it was still illegal. Bush never proved Iraq was in violation of UN Resolutions by still being in possession of weapons of mass destruction, and secondly, that Iraq was behind 9-11. He never proved any of that, he just decided they were off of his zero intelligence he was demanding be cooked up for that year you were speaking of and decided to go right in there. Then he had the gull to declare mission accomplished.

The mission was accomplished by removing Saddam from power. The end game of getting out of Iraq by not going in with a heavy footprint was the SNAFU.

I think it is logical to assume that if Saddam did not have WMD's, he would have cooperated. Saddam restricted the movement of inspectors, therefore, was in violation of UN resoltutions. The war was not illegal per the cease fire agreement. Read it. If Saddam didn't comply, hostilities against him would resume...and they did.

This man was a buffoon and disgraced this country, and cost many young Americans and Iraqi people their lives by not doing his homework, by listening to yes men, and by having no idea of what this enemy was he was going to fight head on, and by not letting generals fight the war. Not only that but he lied to the American people, and the worst part of it all was he told those people that were there and actually suffered through 9/11 that he would get Bin Laden. The man that a month later he really wasn't too concerned with. He took a horrible moment in our nations history, in those people lives and turned it into his own agenda. I don't even want to go into the patriot act.

I really don't need to be lectured about Bush's reluctance to listen to his Generals in lieu of the ongoing conflict with McCrystal and Obama in reference to Afghanistan

I have never supported the Patriot Act and have said so many times.

Lets talk about innocent lives lost. How many innocents died by the US funding Iraq in the Iraq/Iran war because we were miffed at Iran. The war would eneded far earlier if not for our interference. Also, don't forget the US ran interferene for Saddam at the UN when he gassed Iranian soldiers. Then lets look at the other innocent lives lost. The 160,000 Iraqi civilians buried in mass graves following Persian Gulf I who acted on America's words to rise against Saddam. Let's also count the hundreds of thousands who died under UN Sanctions because Saddam was re-routing money intended for the people of Iraq.

Which is worse GM? Taking action to free a people from suffering(especially suffering that America created) understanding that lives would be lost in that endeavor or sitting on the sideliness and just letting people die as long as your digital programming for you television goes unhindered?

Again, your sense of justice is warped. Iraq was a quagmire created long ago by our foreign policy...so don't be knocking Bush for something he tried to right after years of abuse by American diplomats towards innocent Iraqi civilians.

I know my vocabulary. I know he was not a dictator, but the way he handled this was mirroring one. Thank goodness we do live in this country where he couldn't have full control. Although he sure tried with his scare campaign. "Give up freedoms and you'll be safe."Have the gov do their d**n jobs, and we would of been safe!

And Obama is different with his, "worst economy since the 1930's" garbage and the fear mongering going forward about Green House gasses? Fear mongering is a way of getting people to bend to your will and politicians do it often. It's not something that Bush created and yes, when the Islamic terrorism came to the shores of America, you bet your ass people were scared and if you don't think we were...you sir are the Hero..lol

You want a clear solution to all of this. You don't want our bases being attacked in these parts of the world? Leave them. There is no need for us to be there. The only reason we are in these parts are for oil or to have a presence. Lets just leave there. Why wait for someone to blow up a base and bomb them for a week and a half. Whats the point?

Yeah, being bombed is our fault.

Him funding terror and terrorist blowing up American bases does not justify taking a tragedy like 9/11 and using it to go after someone they failed to get 10 years before. Telling those families one thing and doing another is not okay, and it sure as hell isn't the "American" thing to do. Or so I've been told in school.

Helping those throw off the cloak of tyranny is something I was taught in school. I am proud of our servicemen who have served that noble cause.